ANZ.NZX - Anyone holding? [Archive] - Page 4

dabsman

25-09-2020, 04:20 PM

This always happens. Regulators come in and go heavy handed and over time the regulations get slowly erroded to a point that we are back at close to where they started. All that happens is customers have to declare more things and pay more somewhere along the line. A great day for my holdings I have to say

Snoopy

25-09-2020, 05:00 PM

Is the 'happy time' returning to banking? Australia unwinds it's onerous regulation. (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-09-24/australia-to-loosen-lending-laws-to-boost-flow-of-credit)

From the article:

"As part of a sweeping overhaul of so-called responsible lending obligations, the government will allow banks to rely on income and spending information provided by borrowers when assessing loan applications, rather than doing their own lengthy verifications, (Australian) Treasurer Josh Frydenberg said Friday."

Apart from reducing the 'double verification' paperwork by customers and banks, the underlying loans are still going to be the same. The article talks about reducing 'excessive risk aversion' by banks. But surely the opposite is true. If the banks don't spend any time evaluating the borrowers loan credentials themselves, there will be greater uncertainty from a bank perspective. So they will be more risk averse. IOW the process of taking out loans will be cheaper (cut by half as the article suggests). But less loans will be approved.

"Caught in the regulatory cross-hairs, the nation’s biggest lenders became cautious -- stifling credit to the economy even with borrowing costs at record lows."

Sounds like what happened in New Zealand with the government guaranteeing 80% of new bank loans and urging the banks to have loose purse strings. The problem is, under this arrangement, banks must still shoulder the costs of 20% of any loan that goes bad. So the take up by banks of the new Covid-19 inspired scheme in NZ was less than expected.

"Said Kyle Rodda, an analyst at IG Markets Ltd. “There’s a cost element to it -- lower compliance costs, lower regulatory costs -- but banks’ bread and butter is lending out money, and the more money you can lend out the more money you’re going to make.” "

How much money do the banks make on bad loans? Never mind. The CEOs of the big banks commenting in the article think it is a good thing. But will they follow through?

SNOOPY

Arbroath

01-10-2020, 08:04 PM

Went into a branch today in a part of NZ that hadn’t seen a single case in 6 months and is at Level 1 and was asked to sign in using the app. I refused and was asked to sign in manually. I also refused and reminded them it was Level 1 so no requirement to sign in. Was told it was a bank requirement. Walked out and am considering changing banks. I have business personal and trust accounts and have had enough of all the bull**** that passes for H&S in 2020. We have saved 400 lives this year from the lockdown disrupting normal flu (non Covid flu) so maybe let’s just have a lockdown every autumn and destroy the economy as the evidence shows we will hundreds of lives guaranteed!

Waltzing

01-10-2020, 08:38 PM

Oh dear.. systems like this are coming and in a world where virus exists there will be more systems. Get used to it and train yourself to see it as an economic hardening of the system. Forget your life before, its not coming back any time soon. See the new world people, its been here for a while as Bill Gates pointed out and we did not take notice. Notice now and get used to a new world, new systems because be thank full this is not as bad as it can get.

dabsman

01-10-2020, 09:07 PM

Went into a branch today in a part of NZ that hadn’t seen a single case in 6 months and is at Level 1 and was asked to sign in using the app. I refused and was asked to sign in manually. I also refused and reminded them it was Level 1 so no requirement to sign in. Was told it was a bank requirement. Walked out and am considering changing banks. I have business personal and trust accounts and have had enough of all the bull**** that passes for H&S in 2020. We have saved 400 lives this year from the lockdown disrupting normal flu (non Covid flu) so maybe let’s just have a lockdown every autumn and destroy the economy as the evidence shows we will hundreds of lives guaranteed!

Try opening accounts for your businesses, trusts and personal banking. After the hours of forms, trustee declarations, ID requirements and legal costs etc I'd just scan the COVID app if I was you

Waltzing

01-10-2020, 09:23 PM

"Try opening accounts for your businesses, trusts and personal banking"

yes its a nightmare but the westpac saga was appalling and after the GFC we made the mistake or trading the banks in auss.... live and learn and always do your own research... turned out you needed hire investigators... just buy buffet? yep that should have been the game and ive course quantum.

Lion_graf

29-10-2020, 06:16 AM

https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/anz-outage-leaves-thousands-of-aussies-without-pay-041353215.html

Waltzing

29-10-2020, 07:21 AM

whatch out with Y H.. may not be as secure as you need , same with bloom B.

peat

30-10-2020, 12:56 AM

The group ANZ result is down a lot but it is all explained by provisions and an increase in costs, which is bound to be covid.
I have no clue but I keep thinking heaps of these provisions wont be required as things eventually return to a post-covid normal. Of course there will be some actual writeoffs, but imo not to the scale of whats being set aside. Only time will tell but for now I am hanging on to my underwater Aussie banks

Biscuit

30-10-2020, 02:32 AM

The group ANZ result is down a lot but it is all explained by provisions and an increase in costs, which is bound to be covid.
I have no clue but I keep thinking heaps of these provisions wont be required as things eventually return to a post-covid normal. Of course there will be some actual writeoffs, but imo not to the scale of whats being set aside. Only time will tell but for now I am hanging on to my underwater Aussie banks

I'm still above water on ANZ as I topped up quite a bit in April at $16 and $17. Lucky NZ and Aus have handled COVID well. As you say, there are still likely to be business defaults on the way. Low interest rates won't help for the foreseeable future but the strong housing market protects them from any real carnage - long may that last. They likely to be under pressure for a while. If interest rates ever rise again, banks are likely to be one of the shares that benefit, but that might be a lifetime away.

CCcc

14-11-2020, 01:03 AM

Does anyone get any update for the upcoming dividends? I got the email from Shareies but nothing from ASB. Feel strange.

xp04

14-11-2020, 11:18 AM

Does anyone get any update for the upcoming dividends? I got the email from Shareies but nothing from ASB. Feel strange.

https://www.nzx.com/instruments/ANZ/dividends

Bob50

16-06-2021, 08:03 PM

ANZ is my largest holding in my portfolio. Post COVID I viewed it as a good recovery stock. I feel underweight in Heartland.
I wonder if I should transfer funds from one to the other.
My thoughts-
HGH potential dividend 11 cents fully imputed =11/0.72 = 15.28 cps on $2.05 =.7.45%
ANZ dividends prior to COVID seemed to be a steady $1.60 + .18 imputation = 178cps on $31.14 = 5.72%
HGH shares seem to have a steady upward trend with increased company profits each year.
ANZ share price seems over the years to be anything but consistent.
Would anyone favour one over the other at this time?
Thank you.

BlackPeter

17-06-2021, 08:53 AM

ANZ is my largest holding in my portfolio. Post COVID I viewed it as a good recovery stock. I feel underweight in Heartland.
I wonder if I should transfer funds from one to the other.
My thoughts-
HGH potential dividend 11 cents fully imputed =11/0.72 = 15.28 cps on $2.05 =.7.45%
ANZ dividends prior to COVID seemed to be a steady $1.60 + .18 imputation = 178cps on $31.14 = 5.72%
HGH shares seem to have a steady upward trend with increased company profits each year.
ANZ share price seems over the years to be anything but consistent.
Would anyone favour one over the other at this time?
Thank you.

I am holding both ... and roughly similar weighting in my portfolio. Comparing them - forward PE based on analyst estimates is quite similar (13.2 for ANZ and 13.4 for HGH). Forecasted earnings growth for ANZ is however basically zilch (ignoring the 2020 dip) - i.e. this is as good as it gets, while analysts think that HGH has quite some earnings growth potential (forward CAGR of 7).

Do I think the analysts are right? Well, sometimes they are, sometimes they are not, however - I would think that HGH has long term more headroom for further growth than ANZ has. ANZ SP is anyway behaving quite cyclical ... and obviously ... further growth is much harder to achieve for a large entity than for a smaller one.

Still - I think there is space for both in the portfolio, but if the time comes to sell, than I probably will start with ANZ :):

thegreatestben

17-06-2021, 09:44 AM

I picked up both in April last year, HGH is 33% of my portfolio while ANZ is 20%. My % gain has been pretty close on both, recently HGH has pulled ahead.
I like both and I'm happy with my position.

Grimy

17-06-2021, 09:47 AM

I hold HGH, WBC and ANZ, in that order of weighting. Overall, probably accounts for about 9% of my portfolio. As BP mentions, ANZ particularly seems quite cyclical, which is where increased return can be achieved - although obviously over the last year they have all had great buying opportunities. They were 3 of the few stocks I didn't bail on last year. I could have done better if I had, but made good top ups along the way. Happy to hold all 3.

Snoopy

17-06-2021, 10:03 AM

ANZ is my largest holding in my portfolio. Post COVID I viewed it as a good recovery stock. I feel underweight in Heartland.
I wonder if I should transfer funds from one to the other.
My thoughts-
HGH potential dividend 11 cents fully imputed =11/0.72 = 15.28 cps on $2.05 =.7.45%
ANZ dividends prior to COVID seemed to be a steady $1.60 + .18 imputation = 178cps on $31.14 = 5.72%
HGH shares seem to have a steady upward trend with increased company profits each year.
ANZ share price seems over the years to be anything but consistent.
Would anyone favour one over the other at this time?
Thank you.

Bob50, I hold both ANZ and Heartland as well. But I don't see them as directly comparable. From an investment perspective I divide, the finance market into 'Tier 1' , 'Tier 2' and 'Tier 3' players which have different risk/return profiles. ANZ is definitely 'Tier 1', Heartland 'Tier 2' and something like Harmoney 'Tier 3'.

I compare finance sector investments within Tier groups, not across Tier groups. IMO ANZ is a far better banking operator than Westpac for instance (I have held both over many years, and have accounts with both). In Tier 2 I hold both Heartland and Turners (which I keep having to remind people is primarily a finance company with an automotive adjunct). I think the key thing in Tier 2 is to find your niche and be good at executing within it. Heartland and Turners are in different niches, although both are in the automotive loan market and that seems a good space to be. I see a bit more risk going forwards in the Reverse Equity Loan market with the Australian government emerging as a competitor. It is always hard to compete against the government! Nevertheless it is not a full overlap on product offering yet, so Heartland still has an innovative role to play. The transformation to a 'Fintech' for Heartland is both a risk and an opportunity. I back Heartland management to be agile enough to succeed. Turners are probably the more boring investment of the two. But they execute well and sometimes, particularly in finance, boring is a good thing.

Tier 3 investment in financing I leave to others. I get nervous enough with the Tier 2 stuff, and I don't feel I need to accept the risks on what are generally high interest loans to borrowers of dubious credit history.

SNOOPY

Crypto Crude

17-06-2021, 06:30 PM

Appqrently All banking services across australia down. Bitcoin continues on as normal

Crypto Crude

17-06-2021, 09:38 PM

https://7news.com.au/business/banking/commbank-westpac-anz-app-outages-reported-around-australia-as-websites-stop-working-c-3138889

peat

17-06-2021, 11:49 PM

you so onto the failings of the mainstream financial system CC

what I dont quite get is that Akamai, the Content Delivery Network that failed is only supposed to be caching , so if it goes down shouldnt the original source deliver instead? Sure it might be a lot slower, but it still should work - I would have thought.

Crypto Crude

19-06-2021, 01:30 PM

you so onto the failings of the mainstream financial system CC

what I dont quite get is that Akamai, the Content Delivery Network that failed is only supposed to be caching , so if it goes down shouldnt the original source deliver instead? Sure it might be a lot slower, but it still should work - I would have thought.

Hey buddy,
I'm not quite sure how it all works but it's no good...
Seemed the networks were only compromised for a few hours... still though...

kiora

19-06-2021, 02:01 PM

If networks were down then crypto compromised as well?

Crypto Crude

19-06-2021, 11:07 PM

If networks were down then crypto compromised as well?

Nope...
If electricity supply stops even then crypto markets do not shutdown...

JohnnyTheHorse

19-06-2021, 11:12 PM

Nope...
If electricity supply stops even then crypto markets do not shutdown...

Obviously you don't remember all of the crypto exchanges crash a few weeks back.

BlackPeter

20-06-2021, 10:36 AM

This might be the relevant reminder in above context:

12632

Bjauck

20-06-2021, 11:14 AM

I hold HGH, WBC and ANZ, in that order of weighting. Overall, probably accounts for about 9% of my portfolio. As BP mentions, ANZ particularly seems quite cyclical, which is where increased return can be achieved - although obviously over the last year they have all had great buying opportunities. They were 3 of the few stocks I didn't bail on last year. I could have done better if I had, but made good top ups along the way. Happy to hold all 3.
I have held both ANZ and Heartland since 2012. According to Sharesight the return from HGH/HBL has been considerably higher.

If the Australian government ever dismantles the four pillars policy, things could become a bit more dynamic for the mature Australian banks.

Snow Leopard

20-06-2021, 11:25 AM

This might be the relevant reminder in above context:

12632

I can see the family likeness between this and your avatar BP.

Tomtom

21-06-2021, 02:14 PM

Gentlemen, can we just stay on-topic please. Much appreciated! :)

Panda-NZ-

21-06-2021, 09:11 PM

A bloodletting of aussie banks today, following on from the US.

macduffy

22-06-2021, 12:34 PM

A bloodletting of aussie banks today, following on from the US.

And recouping most of that loss today!

macduffy

22-06-2021, 12:35 PM

Deleted duplicate.

RTM

20-07-2021, 09:53 AM

For those interested....(I am)
https://announcements.nzx.com/detail/375867

By my rough calcs...
~ 1.82% of the shares will be bought back.
Not really sure we will even see share price appreciation of that magnitude.
Equates to about 53c per current share...existing count.

Sigh. I've posted enough on my preferences over share buybacks previously.

Waltzing

20-07-2021, 10:06 AM

WBC to come next...

could be just the starter..

dabsman

20-07-2021, 12:00 PM

Awesome use of money. I'd rather this than lose franking credits constantly. Definitely just the start I'd say

Waltzing

24-09-2021, 02:09 PM

CCP getting local cities ready for possible EV default in 30 days... will impact AUS bank stocks for a short time just before results and div time.

dabsman

26-10-2021, 04:01 PM

Any picks on divvy coming? Special Divvy? I'm hoping up to 75c divvy

nztx

28-10-2021, 12:20 PM

Any picks on divvy coming? Special Divvy? I'm hoping up to 75c divvy

Not far off:

72.0 cps proposed Final

https://www.nzx.com/announcements/381694

http://nzx-prod-s7fsd7f98s.s3-website-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/attachments/ANZ/381694/357878.pdf

buy_high_sell_lo

28-10-2021, 01:08 PM

Looks like a decent result. Australia operations is holding steady while New Zealand home loans picked up decently over the last financial year.
Lets see what happens when we enter a higher interest period.

thegreatestben

28-10-2021, 01:34 PM

Decent Div but ANZ made me sell half my holding to secure lending with ANZ for my property development :'(

Waltzing

07-12-2021, 08:23 AM

Banks SP's up in the US. ANZ looks like a good BUY here.

Waltzing

05-01-2022, 08:08 AM

Whole new year and US 10 year should be on a tear .. expect bank stocks to be in the game this year.

Yields on the US 10 year should be out of the blocks as some big players arnt buying at the rate of the last 2 years.

Waltzing

07-01-2022, 01:33 PM

Looking a break out here to the up side.. just breaking back above 30 handle... could start a run back to 32 and above in the next 12 to 24 months.

Im sure you all loaded up back under 28..

Grimy

07-01-2022, 02:24 PM

My last purchase was at $19.83 late 2020.......

Waltzing

07-01-2022, 02:31 PM

"19.83"

hope it was a big buy...

Grimy

07-01-2022, 05:52 PM

Not big enough!

Waltzing

20-01-2022, 03:13 PM

Aus banks should benefit from low jobs but results were before OMI hit.

The Kanda's are kicking it!

They are just a bunch of hard ass's amd nothing seems to keep them down.

Waltzing

19-02-2022, 04:44 PM

The big banks are AUSSI owned but they all work to the whip of Mr Or and NZ statue Law.

Almost impossible to know what going on at the RBNZ.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/300520400/whats-gone-wrong-at-the-reserve-bank

But it probably wont change the performance of the banks until T1 kicks up to 16..

Even then since they are only local its the AUS economy that will determine future SP's not NZ performance.

STr

24-03-2022, 07:30 PM

https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2022/03/24/fireblocks-and-anz-create-aud-stablecoin/

Waltzing

24-03-2022, 09:01 PM

bits and bytes .....

Waltzing

04-05-2022, 10:14 AM

DIV 72, nearly back to 2019 levels.

Holders will be starting to get excited. Interest rates only going higher from here.

Its the 1970's!!!! Well not yet anyone, soon!

dabsman

04-05-2022, 10:36 AM

Happy with that - I've got 70c in my spreadsheet so always nice to increase numbers

huxley

06-05-2022, 01:18 PM

ANZ Group looks at splitting its bank and non-bank businesses into two listed securities.

https://www.interest.co.nz/banking/115654/anz-group-eyes-splitting-its-bank-and-non-bank-businesses-two-ceo-shayne-elliott

Snoopy

06-05-2022, 02:31 PM

ANZ Group looks at splitting its bank and non-bank businesses into two listed securities.

https://www.interest.co.nz/banking/115654/anz-group-eyes-splitting-its-bank-and-non-bank-businesses-two-ceo-shayne-elliott

I could be wrong, but I think that linked article says the opposite. In my reading of that link, it looks like the reorganised ANZ will stay as one listed security. The umbrella listed company would be new, in that it would no longer be a bank. But it would contain one subsidiary as 'the old fashioned bank we know and don't love', while the other subsidiary is free to pursue fintech opportunities, out of the eye of the banking regulatory authorities.

SNOOPY

Waltzing

06-05-2022, 02:38 PM

"'the old fashioned bank we know and don't love',"

has brought a wonder load of profitable trading along with the bunch of slick london SPIV's over at WBC...

huxley

06-05-2022, 03:16 PM

Oh yes, I think you’re right there, whoops:

“Australia's ANZ Group, parent of ANZ New Zealand, announced the plans, to establish distinct bank and non-bank subsidiaries under a share market listed parent holding company”

That actually makes much more sense!

nztx

06-05-2022, 05:40 PM

One of the few in the green among a sea of red today .. :)

Waltzing

06-07-2022, 07:57 AM

might see some down side coming? oh its here already and if these take another hit its becoming a very cheap stock.

US bank earning next few weeks.

Waltzing

11-07-2022, 08:20 PM

buckle up people US bank earnings coming out soon and it could get ugly.

Waltzing

13-07-2022, 12:13 PM

ANZ in talks with some old none QC accounting provider .... bad as buying Xero... unless someone has got a new fully distributed secure app platform.. and none of those old things are anything but old big database in the cloud solution... ancient duuuuummmm stuff....:t_down:

Hoop

13-07-2022, 12:39 PM

buckle up people US bank earnings coming out soon and it could get ugly.

From my history I know when the banks start seeing hard time...It when they allow me to purchase things above my credit card limit before they decline me :):):cool:

Waltzing

14-07-2022, 12:40 PM

Sell off continues really "Emphasise" the economic mood of the south pacific..

or is the sell off also driven by the US earning season to come...

steady selling...

Sideshow Bob

18-07-2022, 09:53 AM

Acquisition and Equity Raising Investor Pack - NZX, New Zealand’s Exchange (https://www.nzx.com/announcements/395491)

Buying Suncorp.

Rawz

18-07-2022, 09:56 AM

1.3x NTA. Thats pretty good

Waltzing

18-07-2022, 12:37 PM

well hopefully share holders are happy with the offer price.

no over subscription on this one.

Waltzing

18-07-2022, 01:07 PM

NO MYOB deal but suncorp up 6% today

what effect could a recession have on the price of this deal.

either way its a big deal...

Bank mergers in AUS up next?

US banks surging it look all green for this sector ...

Nor

18-07-2022, 01:33 PM

Four months ago they announced the completion of a buyback in which they bought back A$1.5 billion worth of shares at A$27.70 average. Seems stupid.

Waltzing

18-07-2022, 02:00 PM

a world ago ....all new world and market... until the next global crisis..

ANZ might need to put some money into sun corps tech stack?

expected lower SP when trading restarts from commentator's

going to be interesting to see if they can keep up the DIV in the next 2 years.

Nor

18-07-2022, 02:53 PM

I can't even see the dots let alone connect them.

Waltzing

18-07-2022, 03:33 PM

The regional banks have old tech stacks that mean NTA could be lower if CAP EX goes up a lot after mergers and take overs...

They can capitalise some of it though. The DIV's for aussi banks and NZ banks could come under pressure depending on capital ratio requirements.

In NZ that means T1 at some stage goes to a HUGE 16%. At least that the story before the virus hit and it was delayed.

That doesnt include the pressure from the like of the NZ prudential board to cover TD's with an extra layer of insurance schemes.

All of which means DIV's come under the spot light.

ANZ would be looking to release capital from NZ but that might not happen if the RBNZ goes though with its new T1 ranges.

Profits to the parents in AUS would come under more pressure with NZ banks being required to hold more capital in reserve.

Rawz

18-07-2022, 03:40 PM

Waltzing I’m pretty sure ALL the banks run old tech lol. That’s my experience anyway

This is why these new fintechs on the block are so interesting..

Waltzing

18-07-2022, 04:53 PM

fintechs would be interesting if they were not linked to a math formula...

at least with flowers you put them on the table or in the window or you can compete at flower shows or sell them after youve grown them.

dont forget weddings need flowers..

good things flowers...one of god's best wonders ..:eek2:

Rawz

18-07-2022, 05:11 PM

fintechs would be interesting if they were not linked to a math formula...

at least with flowers you put them on the table or in the window or you can compete at flower shows or sell them after youve grown them.

dont forget weddings need flowers..

good things flowers...one of god's best wonders ..:eek2:

Speaking of things that grow in the ground. Sounds like you smoked a lot of pot before you posted that as it made no sense at all lol

Waltzing

18-07-2022, 05:26 PM

fintech often uses block chain which sometime uses something called by buffet as akin to some dutch

flowers...bitcoin and blockchain are interleaved with each other.

the great tulip crash ...https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-21/taleb-calls-bitcoin-a-tulip-bubble-without-the-aesthetics#:~:text=Nassim%20Nicholas%20Taleb%20say s%20Bitcoin,said%20in%20a%20tweet%20Thursday.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin

https://www.finextra.com/blogposting/22108/how-and-why-fintech-embraces-blockchain

out testing carbon fibre at high ratings today with heart rates at about 140 which is sub anaerobic and smoking is bad for your health...please dont smoke. one of NZ's retired Olympic coaches invited us out on the water to show off some new tech...

rather own flowers than bit coin at the moment...

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/17/how-the-fall-of-celsius-dragged-down-crypto-investors.html

nztx

18-07-2022, 10:05 PM

Speaking of things that grow in the ground. Sounds like you smoked a lot of pot before you posted that as it made no sense at all lol

Was it planted in a garden outside an ANZ branch somewhere ? ;)

nztx

18-07-2022, 10:14 PM

No take out offer for HGH yet ?

Or is that yet to be considered ? :)

Waltzing

19-07-2022, 08:00 AM

Quality of Suncorp book is stated by ANZ as worth the higher P/E paid.

Doubtful in the light the economic outlook for the next 2 years.

one has to hope that trade between china and Aus holds steady and china does not do a hard landing and that is very unlikely.

Banking sector profits are influenced by global market pressures.

Banks will be scrambling to create new technology platforms without going down the nightmare road to block chain and crypto.

Rawz

19-07-2022, 08:24 AM

Buying at the peak? Right before the big recession crash?

Maybe the guru ANZ bankers at the top level know something we don’t. Maybe no recession like everyone is talking about

Waltzing

19-07-2022, 08:52 AM

Since when have bankers at the top been Guru's. If you read the prize award winning papers from the likes of the prudential board advisors like Helen Dervan you would think the sky's about to fall all the time any time.

US travel is booming but air lines shares are in the doldrums. The investing public believes in the recession and so do the pro's.

mind you those advisors like Dervan were always a bit MY Optic with no sense of fun as i recall.

Very serious legal intellectuals.

Rawz

19-07-2022, 09:00 AM

I guess ANZ had no choice. Organic growth just isnt going to cut it. Had to buy a book. Probably look back in 10 years and think what an amazing move.

Worked well when ANZ bought then merged National Bank. ANZ biggest bank in NZ

Waltzing

19-07-2022, 09:05 AM

Much prefer Rawz's optimistic investing outlook then the Serious case of seriousness that Dervan suffers from.

The summary of the last report from Dervan did nothing after pages and pages of warnings to offer any economic research into optimal structures for capital and prudential structures for NZ banking and the RBNZ and the GOVNT plus the AUS/NZ law society accepted it as a tablet from GOD.

It was nothing but intellectual self congratulatory grand standing.

In terms of restricting business lending and growth it was Down right Dangerous stuff from Dervan and co.

Muse

19-07-2022, 09:08 AM

I guess ANZ had no choice. Organic growth just isnt going to cut it. Had to buy a book. Probably look back in 10 years and think what an amazing move.

Worked well when ANZ bought then merged National Bank. ANZ biggest bank in NZ

basically ANZ just buying back all the marketshare it lost over the last 5 years. they have been getting clobbered by CBA in QLD and over half of suncorps business is there, as well by non bank lenders

Waltzing

19-07-2022, 09:12 AM

QLD the hot spot ... literally insurance must be on fire up in that state with global warming?

Growth must be levelling off there soon?

Aus facing some huge challenges in agri land management in the face of global warming.

Maxtrade

19-07-2022, 10:19 AM

Acquisition to be funded by a fully underwritten 1 for 15 pro rata accelerated renounceable entitlement offer to raise ~$3.5b of ordinary equity and by existing capital
https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/blob:https://www.sharetrader.co.nz/5c2cbf99-dfae-4bb6-9b76-4b23c7ecfc90

• New ANZ shares issued under the entitlement offer will rank equally with existing ANZ shares from the date of issue including future dividends

Thoughts as to what this will do to ANZ NZX listed share price? Another one of those situations where current shareholders are basically forced to cough up more money rather than see their shares diluted and devalue.
If it weren't such a large dominant bank then SP might retrace to SP offer as with many share placement offer in other companies to date. However being a bank which is using the funds to acquire Suncorp maybe investors will actually see it as desirable and in turn SP may not follow general decline to share placement offer after a Cap Raise.

Those who hold large % of banks in their portfolios keen to hear your opinions...

ithaka

19-07-2022, 10:28 AM

An observation from a poster on hotcopper

Bank A is raising capital at 0.9x book value and P/E of 9.5x

...in order to acquire....

Bank B at 1.3x book value and 13.8x P/E.

Discl: hold

Waltzing

19-07-2022, 11:22 AM

good stock to trade going forward.

buy and sell it..hold? not so much..

and hopefully they back any tech other then ...

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/18/crypto-miners-moved-over-300-million-of-bitcoin-in-one-day.html

Waltzing

21-07-2022, 10:47 AM

and they are off racing in the suncorp derby and the stakes could not be higher as they leap out of the stalls on a rain soaked heavy track .....

dabsman

21-07-2022, 12:18 PM

and they are off racing in the suncorp derby and the stakes could not be higher as they leap out of the stalls on a run soaked heavy track .....

Ive got a few ANZ and wanted to top up a few months back but been buying too many HMY. I think there will be a good entry point later in the day on the ASX and then add in the 1 for 15 rights to average down the purchase a little. I'm happy long term with that result

Grimy

21-07-2022, 03:03 PM

I'll probably take up my rights. Mind you, that's not many.

theace

21-07-2022, 04:44 PM

I have some ANZ.NZX through Sharesies ... wonder if purchase rights will be available?

Sideshow Bob

21-07-2022, 04:54 PM

I have some ANZ.NZX through Sharesies ... wonder if purchase rights will be available?

For other shares, holders via Sharesies have been able to participate in such offers. Normally Sharsies will advise direct.

nztx

21-07-2022, 04:56 PM

For other shares, holders via Sharesies have been able to participate in such offers. Normally they've advise direct.

Likewise .. given a Sharesies nominee bulk hold arrangement, I imagine fractions of shares will probably be available for rights ?

Mind you I don't hold many ANZ either..

Waltzing

22-07-2022, 10:40 AM

and ANZ enters the back straight well positioned in the pack but CBA well in the lead...

Waltzing

22-07-2022, 01:26 PM

and ANZ moving up the pack on the back straight after dropping back entering the back straight bend...

:eek2:

Bjauck

22-07-2022, 04:28 PM

If NZ resident ANZ shareholders let their ANZ 1:15 rights lapse and ANZ remit to them a premium for the lapsed rights they sell on their behalf, will that premium become a taxable dividend as far as NZ is concerned? ANZ are relying on NZX listing exemptions and they are not getting approval from any NZ authorities. That would certainly stink big time as ANZ is the biggest bank operating in NZ.

percy

22-07-2022, 04:45 PM

https://stockhead.cmail20.com/t/d-l-fhrhykl-yupddjlly-c/

winner69

22-07-2022, 04:50 PM

https://stockhead.cmail20.com/t/d-l-fhrhykl-yupddjlly-c/

Thats very good eh percy

Bjauck

22-07-2022, 04:51 PM

https://stockhead.cmail20.com/t/d-l-fhrhykl-yupddjlly-c/ To paraphrase Captain Mainwaring: "You silly Bankers, ANZ!"

It just shows you how low NZ has fallen - to let another country's Zombie Bank become our biggest bank.

Nor

22-07-2022, 05:21 PM

If NZ resident ANZ shareholders let their ANZ 1:15 rights lapse and ANZ remit to them a premium for the lapsed rights they sell on their behalf, will that premium become a taxable dividend as far as NZ is concerned? ANZ are relying on NZX listing exemptions and they are not getting approval from any NZ authorities. That would certainly stink big time as ANZ is the biggest bank operating in NZ.

Tax implications probably be covered in the booklet, July 26th I think. May only cover Australian situation but that would be close enough for me if I were not going to take them up.

percy

22-07-2022, 05:24 PM

Thats very good eh percy

He does a weekly article.
Always fun and he nails it.

Bjauck

23-07-2022, 09:55 AM

Tax implications probably be covered in the booklet, July 26th I think. May only cover Australian situation but that would be close enough for me if I were not going to take them up. There are many situations where Australian company issues and distributions have tax implications for NZ residents that are vastly different from the tax implications for Australian residents. The NZ definition of a "dividend" for tax purposes may differ. In addition, in some situations Australian residents have capital gains tax implications, which NZ residents do not.

The info on the implications of the issue is already online. They have only published info on Australian tax consequences despite the issue being available for both Australian and NZ residents. Australian rulings have been obtained.
https://retailentitlementoffer.anz.com/offer/

Nor

23-07-2022, 12:43 PM

So spend hundreds consulting an accountant. Probably cheaper just to declare it as income.

Snoopy

23-07-2022, 02:09 PM

So spend hundreds consulting an accountant. Probably cheaper just to declare it as income.

A rights issue taken up , or proceeds of such if you sell the rights, is not income. No need to spend hundreds of dollars at the accountants office to determine that.

SNOOPY

Bjauck

24-07-2022, 07:53 AM

A rights issue taken up , or proceeds of such if you sell the rights, is not income. No need to spend hundreds of dollars at the accountants office to determine that.

SNOOPY My original question concerned the situation where the NZ resident shareholder lets the rights lapse and ANZ sells those rights on behalf of shareholders. ANZ then distributes any premium obtained to shareholders. Are you saying that distribution, without ANZ getting NZ court approval, is not a taxable dividend in the hands of NZ resident ANZ shareholders?

Dividends are in specie (e.g. DRiP or demerger) or cash distributions to a shareholder from a company . Distributions may be subject to NZ income tax. Disclaimer: As far as I understand. DYOR.

Snoopy

24-07-2022, 10:10 AM

My original question concerned the situation where the NZ resident shareholder lets the rights lapse and ANZ sells those rights on behalf of shareholders. ANZ then distributes any premium obtained to shareholders. Are you saying that distribution, without ANZ getting NZ court approval, is not a taxable dividend in the hands of NZ resident ANZ shareholders?

Dividends are in specie (e.g. DRiP or demerger) or cash distributions to a shareholder from a company . Distributions may be subject to NZ income tax. Disclaimer: As far as I understand. DYOR.

A rights issue is the way that shareholders contribute capital to a company. It is a capital transaction where you as a shareholder give money to the company to allow ANZ (in this instance) to expand its capital base. It is you as a shareholder giving money to the ANZ, - not the other way around.

The markets may price this 'right', a capital asset to have value, if someone is prepared to pay more than the rights issue execution price. If so, you may sell this 'right', which is I repeat an asset, to another player in the market. In this particular situation, ANZ has offered to act as an intermediary, forwarding on any 'premium obtained' that a third market player was willing to pay for your 'right'. This 'premium money' has not come from ANZ. It has come from the third party market player that bought your rights,

If you are still not convinced, think of it this way. If you had taken up your rights, it would have been you that was giving new capital to the ANZ directly. Are you seriously suggesting that if you contribute new operating capital to a company that you should pay tax on your own capital contribution? I don't disagree with anything you have written in the post I am replying to. But the money you get from selling your rights rather than executing them is not a cash distribution from ANZ. It is cash being paid for an asset (in this case your 'right') on behalf of someone else (the third party that bought your rights).

SNOOPY

Nor

24-07-2022, 04:17 PM